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Subject: Paradise Club, NYC

>Paradise Club
>50 West 33rd St. (Between 5th and Broadway)
>2 blocks from Madison Square Garden [Penn Station, EASY to get to]

Easy way to find it: it's just across the street from the Empire State
Building, on the south (downtown) side.

>was free, since it was before 8 p.m.

 I've noticed that the cover after 8PM has a tendency to fluctuate based
on a variety of factors, including the time of the evening, appearance of
the patrons, number of people already in the club, and whether there's a
Knicks or Rangers game about to let out at the Garden. I've seen the cover
go as high as $20 (I was carrying a duffel bag - tourist alert! - and a
Rangers playoff game was going on - heavy crowds expected). On the other
hand, on one Wednesday night when I came in at 11:30 PM wearing a business
suit, the bouncer just waved me in. That was a slow night, and no sooner
had I sat down than I had one girl on my lap and two more hanging over my

>  I had no idea what to do, what one
>could do, what was legal, what was expected, etc., and that placed some
>real limits.  One drink was mandatory, and I was already suffering alcohol
>poisoning (though otherwise functional), so I had a soda, at maybe $4 or
>so, someone else bought it for me.

 A couple of things to note: the Paradise is a high-class, big-money-making
establishment, and the owners don't want to lose this gold mine, so they
try very hard to stay within New York State laws. This means that, since it's
a fully nude club, no alcohol is served. It also means no touching of bare
breasts or genitals by the customers.

>Fascinating!  Then she went away, and another stripper came out, and asked
>us for dollars before she did anything!  Lame, that one!

 Of course there's a wide range of personalities to be found at the Paradise.
Some of the girls genuinely like what they're doing, and some are very bitchy
and mercenary. There's a process of natural selection at work on this, too:
the girls who enjoy their work give the customers a good time, they get the
better tips, they're happy, they keep enjoying the work. The ones with attitude
problems don't make as much in tips, so they try harder to hustle guys into the
private dances or VIP rooms, guys get annoyed with this and blow them off, the
girls get bitchier. I wish that this process would weed out the bitchy ones,
but some of them must really need the money, because there are a few who've
been there for a couple of years, and just keep getting nastier.

>What I still
>didn't understand is that the main area was so small.  There were unusual
>neon signs, like "Jungle Room" and "Dungeon," which I almost tried to
>walk through--I don't think it would have been allowed, but the doorways
>were not obviously guarded.

 Well, what you have to keep in mind is that the primary function of the
Paradise is to part fools from their money. The strip stage is just a tease,
and while one to five girls are up there dancing for dollar tips, the rest
of the girls are trying to entice guys into the more expensive features.

>She asked me if I wanted to do
>anything, basically, and I asked what was possible.  She suggested the
>Jungle Room, where I could supposedly give her a bubble bath, or get a
>massage, or we could lie down on the floor together (whatever THAT meant).
>I asked what the Dungeon was.  She said that was for S&M and B&D, and did I
>know what those were?  First I tried to say yes, after all, I read Usenet,
>but that wouldn't tell me what went on in this place--what we talk about,
>think about, and do in private, and what we can pay for may differ greatly!
>So I asked what was possible, and she said she could tie me up and whip me
>and "stuff like that."  She wanted $175 for 30 minutes of any of those
>things, or $300 per hour.

 A couple of years ago, after having severely bent my credit card and made
friends with one of the girls, I got a tour of the place (it had just been
remodeled then, and the Jungle Room and the whole upstairs and downstairs
levels had just been added). Upstairs are the VIP rooms, where you pay $200
and up to spend half an hour or so with one of the girls in a mostly-private
booth, equipped with couches, a stool, and a video monitor showing soft porn.
You can slow dance, or sit on the couch while she dances nude for you, or
just sit and chat, which is what I ended up doing more often than not when I
went up there. Again, remember that this place wants to stay open and making
money, so there won't be any "hanky-panky" going on in there no matter how
much you pay. I've heard that some girls will let you touch their breasts in
the VIP rooms, and once I exchanged some heartfelt if rather tame kisses
(full lip contact but no tongue) with one of the girls, but these are very
rare and certainly things won't go farther than that.

 There was also a "Cabaret" area upstairs, where I was told they planned to
have lounge singers on certain nights of the week. This was a pretty radical
idea for a strip club, and I wasn't sure if it would fly. Apparently neither
were the owners of the place, but they had money burning a hole in their
pocket and wanted to try it out. I haven't heard anything about this in the
past couple of years, so it may not have panned out.

 Downstairs is the "Dungeon", where they primarily have girl-girlbondage
and S&M shows for an extra charge. Not being into this, I've never checked
it out (except for that walk-through tour, when nobody was there), so I
can't say much about it. I hadn't heard of B&D/S&M being practiced with
customers, but hey, give the buyers what they want... (-:

 On the main level, there's the slow touch dancing room and the Jungle Room,
both of which you're going to drop at least 30 beans if you go in with a
girl. When I went into the Jungle Room, it was just a place where the girl
would strip completely naked and do a dance on a stool in front of you -
no touching. I really didn't find this to be much fun, so I only tried it
the one time. The bubble bath must be a new addition.

>and she told me that a "Private Nude Dance" or a "Touch Dance" would be
>$20 for 7 minutes.
>The "Touch Dance" meant that she took me into a semi-private room, where
>all touch dances take place, and then I could touch her ass (no tit
>touching, but I'm into asses far more anyhow and didn't care!), hold her to
>me, and dry hump her.
>Then the timer woman
>called time, and she stood on a platform (I don't know why).

 I haven't figured out the reason behind the platform myself.

> The timer
>woman told me to give the dancer/hostess a good tip, and suggested $10
>which seemed fair, so that's what I gave her, and she kissed me on the
>cheek and said thank you.  Then she tried briefly to talk me into the
>private nude dance, but naturally I wasn't "up" for it.

 Again, remember that the mission of the Paradise is to obtain as much of
your money as possible, and it's easier to do this if you're having a good
time in the process. One hustle which worked on me the first time I went
there: the "timer woman" (or hostess, or whatever) came up to us during
our slow dance and said something like "I'm going to have to keep an eye
on you two, you're having such a good time, you might do something illegal"
and basically kept encouraging me to buy more dances by telling me that
she'd never seen this girl have such a good time with a guy in there. Then
after a few dances, the girl suggested we go to a VIP room, and the hostess
took me aside and said something like "She _never_ asks a guy to go in a
VIP room, I think she really likes you." So sue me, I had "gullible" written
on my forehead that day. We did have a good time in the VIP room, and the
girl was really nice, but my plastic was smoking by the time I left there.
The next time I went there, the same hostess tried the same hustle on me and
a different girl (I don't think she recognized me; I'd grown a beard and was
wearing better clothes). I just smiled and said "I'll bet you say that to
all the guys" and politely declined the next dance. This hostess was an older
lady with a Slavic accent (she said she was Bulgarian) and played the
sincere grandmotherly role really well; probably the reason I fell for it so
easily the first time was that she reminded me of my own Eastern European
grandmothers. Anyhow, just a little caveat emptor for those who may be as
naive as I was on my first visit.

>So, my question is, what actually goes on in places like this one, or
>Runway 69, and similar clubs?

 Well, I hope I've helped to answer this question.

>For example, they advertise, "dominant
>mistresses available."  What can they do?

 I'm not speaking from personal experience, but based on what I know of the
legal limits:

>Whipping?  Paddling?  Restraint?

 You could probably get these.

>Can I ask them to fuck me with a strap-on dildo?

 You can ask, but I'm sure at the Paradise they won't do it. (-: Try one
of the real S&M clubs like the Vault.

> Same thing in the "Jungle Room," is it just a
>massage, or can you say, lick and suck their breasts?  What is in the WAY
>upstairs steps that had no sign?

 I've answered these as best I could. I'd be happy to hear anything that
other people could add.

>I'm toying with the idea of actually trying some of this stuff,
>and I don't want to learn anything the hard way.

 Smart man.

>And if this particular place is a ripoff (maybe),
>are there places that offer these kinds of things and are more satisfying
>but harder to find?

 Well, "ripoff" is a personal judgment, but the Paradise is certainly a
money sink. If you want to try B&D/S&M, there are people who'll be happy
to introduce you to it for a lot less money - hell, you can do it for free
if you meet the right people. There are escort services and brothels where
you can get dominant mistresses for about half of what the Paradise charges.
Ditto for more "vanilla" sexual activity like an erotic massage. If you're
in NYC on a regular basis, walk into any adult video store and check out
the contact magazines. If you want to just sit back with a drink and watch
women take their clothes off, and occasionally slow dance with one, then
go for the Paradise - at least it has the advantage of having the largest
selection of really hot women of all the Manhattan strip clubs.

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